About the test:
paddling conditions and paddlers.
Design.
Scorpio Mk2 MV with Cetus MV behind.
The Scorpio Mk2 MV is a development of the successful Scorpio 170, which was itself modelled on the Cetus composite range. In size The Scorpio Mk2 MV is longer and wider than the old Scorpio 170 and shorter and wider than the Cetus MV. Its volume is midway between these other kayaks. However, on the beach it looks very similar to the Cetus MV. Its wide point is just behind the cockpit. It has moderate tail rocker and quite marked bow rocker. Under hull it has a shallow V from the keel line running into softly rounded chines. The Scorpio Mk2 MV is 525cm long and 58cm wide. It is 317l in volume. Apart from being longer and wider than the original Scorpio 170, the Scorpio Mk2 MV has a lowered rear deck and cockpit rim and the lips of the hatch rims have been modified to allow easier fitting of the covers. The foredeck has been modified with inserts for attaching a sailing rig mast foot and mouldings for split paddle handles lie on either side of the compass recess. These mouldings make the foredeck very stiff and unlike many PE kayaks it requires no further reinforcement for the fitting of a mast foot. The line of the deck from the side of the cockpit to the mast foot has been modified to allow the stowed sailing rig to lie neatly. Two of the deck lines' recessed deck fittings (RDFs) have been moved to allow fitting mast side stays at right angles to the mast. The skeg/skudder control has been moved from the side of the fore deck to the top.
Construction, finish, fittings and ergonomics.
Unwrapping the Scorpio Mk2 MV was a treat. It is a beautifully proportioned sleek kayak despite its maximum breadth and the attention to detail is superb e.g. the embossed P&H logo on the alloy security bar. The boat is constructed from three layer CoreLite polyethylene. It is stiff for a PE boat and at 28.7 kg is remarkably only 0.5kg heavier than a diolen composite Cetus MV in expedition layup with a keel strip. New for 2016, the roto-molded Scorpio Mk2 will be available in CoreLite X which will be even lighter and stiffer. The bulkheads are of 7.5cm thick black foam. This has considerably reduced the volume of the rear day hatch which is 15cm shorter compared with that in the composite Cetus MV. The test boat was supplied in a stunning marbled "Ikea" blue (it matched my bags!) The moulding was particularly well finished with some matt and glossy areas. Large glossy P&H logos appear on the fore deck and the under hull. Rather disappointingly either side of the hull at the bow is finished in matt. This means that you cannot mount a suction cup for a remote camera on an extension rod. (if you don't have a sail then the flat mast base area would be a good alternative camera mounting point.) There is an alloy security bar behind the cockpit which I use for attaching a tow line using a water ski quick release shackle.
On the foredeck there is a forward mini hatch. Its cover
is very easy to remove and fit but like many other PE kayaks the mini hatch is
not waterproof. The round fore hatch and oval rear hatch have rubber KayakSport
covers and are indeed much easier to fit than on previous P&H PE kayaks
like my Delphin. The rear day hatch is a lightweight model with a plastic
centre and was very easy to open and close when on the water. As mentioned above, the rear day hatch is considerably smaller than the equivalent hatch in the Cetus MV due to the fact that the two foam bulkheads are a total of 15cm thick. If volume is important to you on expedition it might be worth considering the Scorpio Mk2 HV which will be released in mid 2016. The hatch
recesses have moulded drainage channels. In normal use and during rolling
sessions the three main hatches remained bone dry. The boat had the usual
excellent P&H deck elastic and deck line arrangement. I particularly like
the fact that the rear deck lines come right up to the rear of the cockpit.
This allows the paddle to be secured during a paddle float re-entry.
The Scorpio Mk2 MV comes either the MK2 P&H skeg or the Skudder. I have found the MK2 skeg
to work faultlessly on other kayaks, as long sand is washed out of the skeg box
and the tension in the downhaul elastic is regularly checked.
The skeg (and
skudder) adjustment slider has been moved from the left side of the onto the
top of the deck to the left of the midline. This is a great move as it stops
your paddle hand catching and releasing it (especially if you are wearing
pogies). Even walking past a boat with the slider mechanism in the original
position can brush against and release the skeg which is not good if you are about
to push it back into the water. The new position is out of the way and easy to
get to. I use a large deck bag for a DSLR camera. I needed to fit it slightly
forward to clear the skeg adjuster but I could still reach it easily. The only
disadvantage of the new position is that it is a sand trap if you are launching
in dumping surf on a sand beach. So keep an eye on this and wash any sand out
without delay.
The cockpit is 80cm long which means I found it easy to get in
and out, even with bad knees. The cockpit rim has been modified and I found a
Reed spray dick fitted securely and had no tendency to come off in dumping
surf. The deck round the cockpit is also very stiff and flexes very little when
bracing your legs in the comfortable, adjustable thigh braces. Tools are
required to adjust the thigh braces but it is a straightforward job. The seat
is the P&H Connect seat with padded cover and adjustable backrest and hip
pads. It is fitted nice and low in the cockpit. I found it easy to get a very
comfortable fit in the Scorpio Mk2 MV as did most of the testers. The largest tester
did find his feet (UK size 12, 89cm inside leg) cramped but I had no trouble
with my size 10 Lomo boots with 74cm inside leg. The 55kg paddler enjoyed the
Scorpio Mk2 MV but is considering buying the Scorpio Mk2 LV which is a more appropriate
size.
The test boat was fitted with the optional Skudder, a
combined rudder and skeg mounted in the usual skeg position. It has a decent
sized blade to aid control. It is also considerably stiffer than the standard
P&H skeg.
All the control cables are contained within the boat and the rear
control levers over the rudder are covered by a flush plastic cover on the rear
deck. The rear hatch looses a little room compared with a simple skeg box but
long thin items can still go up either side. The Skudder is incredibly well
designed and engineered especially given the price of the boat it is fitted to.
It is controlled by Smart Track foot pedals, which self adjust as the footrests
are slid back and forwards. It did not need any adjustment during the test.
In use it acts as a skeg if you deploy it up to just over half way. If you put
it fully down the pedals can now turn it and it acts like a rudder. It does not
self centre as you put it away so you need to centre it with your feet first.
Until you get used to this, do not leave it till the last minute before
landing.
The only downside is that the pivot pin for the Skudder is in an
exposed position at the front of the skeg box. The hinge is unaffected by
shingle, mud, or fine sand but some coarse shell sands (as found on the Outer
Solway) can jam it and If the boat has been sitting on such sand you should
make sure it is clear after launching but before getting into the boat. Some rental companies using Venture kayaks with the Skudder have experienced problems with the vertical rod which turns the rudder. At the end of the test I dismantled the Skudder but found no problems. Either the design/construction has changed or rental kayaks get much more wear than the 700km I covered and the 300km others covered in this Scorpio kayak.
The test kayak came with the P&H Code Zero sailing rig.
The mast, stays and mast foot are supplied by Kari-Tek. The sail is made by
Flat Earth in Australia and uses a very similar cut to their own Trade Wind
sail. The P&H sail was tested in OP #46. Since then, P&H have changed
to a four stay design from Kari-Tek's three stay system. Three mini karabiners
are supplied for the side and back stays so that once you have their length
adjusted, you can quickly remove and fit the sail without need for further
adjustment. As mentioned above, two of the RDF's have been moved so that they
are at right angles to the mast foot, which is the ideal position for attaching
the two side stays.
The two cleats for the uphaul/forestay and the sheet have
fairleads. I prefer cleats without fairleads so that the lines can be released
instantly (without fear of re-jamming) in the event of a sudden squall or
capsize. The sail has a shorter luff than previous Flat Earth sails and on the
standard mast you can see forward under it so no window is required in the
sail.
Overall performance.
I felt comfortable in the Scorpio Mk2 MV straight away. I have been sea
kayaking as often as I can for 13 years and when I first saw how beamy the Scorpio Mk2 MV was, I wondered whether I would find it boring to paddle. I also
thought if it would feel more uncontrollable in really rough conditions than a
boat like my Nordkapp LV, which is narrow with highly rocked, low volume ends.
Surprisingly the Scorpio Mk2 MV is remarkably unflappable in the rough stuff.
Photo from the Scorpio MK2 MV off Garroch Head.
I was
taking photographs with my DSLR in F4/5 wind over a spring tide in the Garroch
Head tide race in conditions I would not have dared to take the camera out in
the Nordkapp LV.
The Scorpio Mk2 MV off Garroch Head Photo by Ian Johnston
I think that some advanced paddlers may be surprised by the
Scorpio Mk2 MV's abilities. It would make a great, robust kayak for guiding or
coaching. Not once during my time with the Scorpio Mk2 MV did I feel that I would
rather be in one of my other kayaks. I now wonder whether a composite kayak with
a similar maximum beam but the overall slim lines of the Scorpio Mk2 MV shape might
be a success? Whatever, I think P&H have hit a sweet spot with this design.
Stability and rolling
The Scorpio Mk2 MV is remarkably stable for a touring sea kayak due both to its width and rear set wide point. It is an ideal platform for coaching, photography, bird watching or fishing. It is incredibly stable when on edge and is great fun when weaving through rock gardens. It rolls very smoothly but a little more slowly than the narrower Cetus MV. The lowered rear cockpit edge makes back deck rolling much more comfortable than the old Scorpio, without having to raise your backside off the seat.
The Scorpio Mk2 MV is remarkably stable for a touring sea kayak due both to its width and rear set wide point. It is an ideal platform for coaching, photography, bird watching or fishing. It is incredibly stable when on edge and is great fun when weaving through rock gardens. It rolls very smoothly but a little more slowly than the narrower Cetus MV. The lowered rear cockpit edge makes back deck rolling much more comfortable than the old Scorpio, without having to raise your backside off the seat.
Speed, manoeuvrability
and tracking
The Scorpio Mk2 MV is easily able to maintain a normal all day touring pace of 6-7.5km/hour whether loaded or unloaded. Despite paddling regularly with three other paddlers in Cetus MVs at no time did I feel disadvantaged, even after a day where we covered 47km. The glide and tracking are both improved over the old Scorpio 170. Despite being more directional when paddling a course than its elder sibling it was noticeably faster to turn on edge. I found my maximum burst speed was about 10% down compared with the Cetus MV in the same conditions. When paddle sailing in waves in a good F4/5 day my top speed in the Scorpio Mk2 MV was 18km/hour on the best wave and 20.5km/hr in the Cetus MV on its best wave. A little skeg helps with tracking as the wind picks up but the adjustment range on the slider (when in skeg mode) is shorter than on a conventional skeg and so it is a bit more tricky to get just the right amount of skeg.
The Scorpio Mk2 MV is easily able to maintain a normal all day touring pace of 6-7.5km/hour whether loaded or unloaded. Despite paddling regularly with three other paddlers in Cetus MVs at no time did I feel disadvantaged, even after a day where we covered 47km. The glide and tracking are both improved over the old Scorpio 170. Despite being more directional when paddling a course than its elder sibling it was noticeably faster to turn on edge. I found my maximum burst speed was about 10% down compared with the Cetus MV in the same conditions. When paddle sailing in waves in a good F4/5 day my top speed in the Scorpio Mk2 MV was 18km/hour on the best wave and 20.5km/hr in the Cetus MV on its best wave. A little skeg helps with tracking as the wind picks up but the adjustment range on the slider (when in skeg mode) is shorter than on a conventional skeg and so it is a bit more tricky to get just the right amount of skeg.
The Skudder
I was not expecting a great deal from the Skudder in rudder mode. I was wrong
and as the months on test went by, I found I was using the rudder mode more and
more, even without the sail! It is not a panacea for manoeuvring a kayak but
unlike some systems I have tried, it does have a big enough blade to be
effective, even when paddling at 45 degrees to the wind (when some rudder
systems are better lifted as they cause lee cocking if you cannot paddle fast
enough). The 5* paddler felt there was no need for the rudder as the Scorpio Mk2 MV
was so manoeuvrable when edged. Initially I agreed but then I discovered that
the Skudder works remarkably well for more advanced paddlers when used with
edging and steering strokes. Then I noticed that two of the early intermediate
paddlers had started to automatically edge the kayak when they were using the
Skudder! The beginners loved it.
See here for a detailed review of the Skudder.
Behaviour in wind and
waves
Due to its sleek low profile and rocker line the Scorpio Mk2 MV is very well
behaved in wind. It gently weathercocks but this is easily controlled by the
Skudder in either skeg or rudder mode. The low profile means that in choppy
conditions when paddling to windward the Scorpio Mk2 MV is quite a wet kayak.
However, it is dry when paddling downwind and the tail rocker is very good at
picking up following seas. Once on a wave the bow rocker keeps the bow clear of
the water if you get the kayak planing. If you stuff it down into the trough
then the bow rocker helps prevent purling (nose diving). Like other kayaks with
a rear set wide point the Scorpio Mk2 MV is surprisingly manoeuvrable if you stay
high on the wave. This can lead to a sudden broach but more advanced paddlers
will be able to use this manoeuvrability to correct early and run straight.
Paddling when
loaded
The Scorpio Mk2 MV is a bit more directional when
loaded with camping gear and if anything the Skudder in rudder mode is even
more useful on such a trip. Although the wide point of the kayak is aft of the
cockpit, the rear deck is low so the rear hatches do not have so much volume as
some kayaks of similar length and overall volume. As a result it is easy to put
too much weight in the front. It is important to distribute the weight about
60% in the rear and 40% at the front otherwise the kayak will develop excessive
weather cocking. If you get the balance right the loaded Scorpio Mk2 MV is
delightfully neutral to paddle whatever the wind or wave conditions.
Paddle sailing.
The Scorpio Mk2 MV is a great boat for paddle sailing, especially if you are
new to using a sail or don't like drilling holes in a new boat. (You still need
to decide where to mount the two cleats but as they screw into the cockpit area
you won't be worried about creating a leak.) Neither do you need to worry about
where to mount the mast foot as P&H have already found the best position.
Even beginners to kayaking were happy to deploy the sail in sheltered
conditions. Newcomers to paddle sailing need to realise that you don't just sit
there letting the sail do the work. You will soon get cold.
It is much more fun
to paddle hard and use the sail for extra speed, especially downwind when you
can catch faster waves than when using paddle power alone. More advanced paddle
sailors will find the stability of the Scorpio Mk2 MV very reassuring as they push
their paddle sailing into stronger wind and wave conditions. When travelling
fast downwind, you need to be light footed with the Skudder. It is easy to
steer too far one way then overcorrect the other. When paddle sailing downwind
on an 11km crossing in F4 conditions with two paddle sailors in Cetus MVs, I
found I was actually faster using the Skudder in skeg mode than rudder mode. In
F4 winds the Skudder is big and effective enough to tack the Scorpio Mk2 MV through
the wind. Most other over stern ruddered kayaks I have used for paddle sailing
in such winds are easier to tack if you lift the rudder first.
Conclusions
As the sun went down on my last night camping from the Scorpio Mk2 MV I reflected on what a great kayak I had enjoyed.
As the sun went down on my last night camping from the Scorpio Mk2 MV I reflected on what a great kayak I had enjoyed.
The Scorpio Mk2 MV is such a versatile kayak that if it had been available when
I started sea kayaking 13 years ago I would probably still have it. Over the 4 months of the test (during one of the windiest summer and autumns in 20 years) I really
grew to appreciate its versatility and forgiving nature. The various features
of the Scorpio Mk2 MV with Skudder and sail are so complimentary that the whole is
truly greater than the sum of its parts. Not only is this an ideal kayak for
those starting off in sea kayaking but it will grow with them and support the
development of advanced skills. It would also make a great kayak for coaching. Lastly,
the Scorpio Mk2 MV with Skudder and sail must be the easiest way into paddle
sailing. The only thing I can find wrong with it is that P&H wanted it
back!
Disclaimer
Three years ago I spent an hour and a half drifting in my kayak on the Solway. I was on the phone to Graham Mackereth of P&H. We were discussing what sort of features would make a new, all round sea kayak suitable for all abilities and be ideal for those interested in paddle sailing. I am delighted to discover that many of those ideas have now made it into production. I am glad that a manufacturer was prepared to listen to customer feedback and act on it. This may have led to some bias in this review so I suggest anyone thinking of purchasing such a kayak goes and test paddles the Scorpio Mk2 MV and makes their own mind up.
Specifications of Scorpio Mk2 range
Scorpio MK2 LV
Length: 508cm
Width: 53cm
Volume: 271l
Weight: 27.5 kgs (CoreLite) 25kg (CoreLite X)
Paddler weight range: 50-110kg
Scorpio MK2 MV (as tested)
Length: 525cm
Width: 58cm
Volume: 317l
Weight: 29.5kgs (CoreLite) 26.5kgs (CoreLite X)
Paddler weight range: : 65-125kg
Price: with skeg RRP: CoreLite £1,299 CoreLite X £1484
with Skudder RRP: CoreLite £1,399 CoreLiteX £1584
Scorpio Mk2 HV will be available mid 2016.
Three years ago I spent an hour and a half drifting in my kayak on the Solway. I was on the phone to Graham Mackereth of P&H. We were discussing what sort of features would make a new, all round sea kayak suitable for all abilities and be ideal for those interested in paddle sailing. I am delighted to discover that many of those ideas have now made it into production. I am glad that a manufacturer was prepared to listen to customer feedback and act on it. This may have led to some bias in this review so I suggest anyone thinking of purchasing such a kayak goes and test paddles the Scorpio Mk2 MV and makes their own mind up.
Specifications of Scorpio Mk2 range
Scorpio MK2 LV
Length: 508cm
Width: 53cm
Volume: 271l
Weight: 27.5 kgs (CoreLite) 25kg (CoreLite X)
Paddler weight range: 50-110kg
Scorpio MK2 MV (as tested)
Length: 525cm
Width: 58cm
Volume: 317l
Weight: 29.5kgs (CoreLite) 26.5kgs (CoreLite X)
Paddler weight range: : 65-125kg
Price: with skeg RRP: CoreLite £1,299 CoreLite X £1484
with Skudder RRP: CoreLite £1,399 CoreLiteX £1584
Scorpio Mk2 HV will be available mid 2016.
Douglas, thank you very much for your detailed review which has been influential in me and my wife, as relative beginners, getting Scorpio Mk2 LV and MV in the new corelite x. I am also interested in learning to paddle sail so got the sail from Karitek but have yet to install it. I am based on the River Tay by Dundee so most paddling is estuary based but hope to get over to the west coast in the summer for some longer trips. I look forward to reading your future blogs.
ReplyDeletekind regards
Paul
Thank you Paul, I very much look forward to trying the CoreLite X myself. It was bad enough handing the CoreLite Scorpio back! I also hope you enjoy paddle sailing :o)
DeleteHi Douglas. I have recently taken possession of my Scorpio MK2 LV after an 8 month wait to get it to my home in Queensland, Australia. I have been anxiously awaiting your review, however I couldn't stand it any longer and purchased a copy of Ocean Paddler #49 only 2 weeks ago. Like you, I find the Scorpio an extremely forgiving, yet nimble kayak that encourages you explore your capabilities. It is very fast for a PE kayak and tracks extremely well. So well in fact, I have time to get my camera out, focus and take the shot and still be heading in the same direction. Not possible in my other skeg kayak. I am a keen kayak sailor as are many kayakers here in Aus and it was a delight to be able to fit my existing sail on to a kayak in 30 minutes. I have had a couple of issues which my dealer and P&H are currently dealing with, and so far, to my satisfaction, and that is with the skeg version I found that the slider when fully deployed lowered the quite large skeg blade a full 90 degrees and I assume that the stresses in the water whilst deployed and therefore outside of the protection of the skeg box caused the plastic components to self destruct. The skeg has now been replaced thanks to my dealer and P&H and I put in a fix by placing a small piece of plastic tubing on the slider bar to prevent full deployment. Also I have found that it takes very little sand to jam up the spring and prevent deployment. With no wire you are totally reliant on the wound spring in the mechanism. My second issue was that unlike your hatchesin the review, my hatches leak quite badly. In particular the rear day hatch with the "snap on" lid where I have almost 2 cms water washing around after 3 rolls. Not good as my pump battery box is in there in a Tupperware box. P&H have advised there were some hatch rim issues with some early moulds, which apparently my kayak is one. I have some new hatch lids coming next week from the dealer to hopefully rectify this issue. My wife and I currently have 5 sea kayaks and we have owned quite a few others but, I must say that this Scorpio Mk2 LV is without doubt the go to kayak in our fleet for comfort, performance, responsiveness and just downright fun, and it looks a picture as well.
ReplyDeleteThank you for your blog. I have been enjoying it for many years now. Peter
Greetings Peter, thank you for your kind comments. As you say the skeg should only come down to 70 degrees. Normally the movement at the slider will only allow the skeg to come to yo degrees from the fully up position. Does your skeg go fully up or does it stick down a bit in the up position? You can shorten the blue control line at the sked but it is a bit tricky as the non stretch cord is difficult to untie. I buy a spare blue cord.
DeleteThe two parts of the red axle can press against the skeg. The trick is to unscrew them so that the hexagons at each end of the axle can only just fit into the slot in the skeg box.
The downhaul elastic does stretch with time. I replace it each year. I also store the kayak with the skeg down.
I assume that you have carefully checked the hatch rims for any small imperfections. The day hatch cover is made of a different material and is intolerant of small bumps dips etc. You can carefully smooth the hatch rim with some fine abrasive paper. I then spray the inner edge of the hatch cover with some silicone spray or furniture polish so that it is easier to completely seat.
Another thing to check is where the skeg/skudder control lines go through the foam bulkheads. These do not normally leak because the foam is about 7.5cm thick but it would be worth while putting some sikaflex round the cable where it enters the foam.
Hope that helps.
Douglas :o)
Thanks for your suggestions Douglas. I will certainly consider them. With regard to the skeg deployment, the blade deployed a full 90 degrees pointing directly south. I recall commenting to my wife how much it effective it would be not even considering the effect of the stresses on the components. Another thing which concerns me with the skeg is that it takes very little sand to gum up the whole works. The spring inside the skeg is not strong enough to release when there is the minimum sandy obstruction. Did you find that to retract the skeg it required quite a lot of effort to push the slider forward? I am currently waiting on 2 replacement hatch covers which hopefully will sort out my leaking issues.
DeleteA sail on the weekend with 15 knots on the rear quarter was a buzz. This is a seriously fun kayak which ticks a whole lot of boxes.
Cheers....Peter
Hi Peter, Nice to see another P&H paddler downunder (I'm in Hobart).
DeleteI have a Delphin and it leaked very badly into the rear compartment at first. I thought it was the hatches too, but I tested it by filling the compartment with water and turning the boat over. The water leaked out through everywhere except the hatches! The deck fittings that went all the way through the deck and had clips holding the skeg/rudder tubes were the worst offenders. Also where the skeg cord tube went through the hull to the skeg, and the holes through the foam bulkhead into the cockpit. Once I sealed all those things, the compartment was totally watertight with even surfing and vigorous rolling resulting in no water ingress.
So I'd suggest testing all the possible bits where water could get in and seal them as needed.
Good luck! Stuart
Thanks for your extra helpful input Stuart. :o)
DeleteI had no idea you could get sails for kayaks, that's so cool!
ReplyDeleteHi Ben, not just cool, but great fun as well! :o)
DeleteHello, Douglas, excellent review, I found it very informative.
ReplyDeleteI notice that you carried a spare split paddle on the stern deck lines but, because of the skudder position, the deck line are now moved further forward. This means the paddle is not held as secure as it would without the skudder. Do you see this as an issue? Assume though this can be easily fixed by using an additional bungee cord? Why did you not use the new paddle recess at the bow end? Like you, I also prefer carrying a split at stern side.
Thanks, McAndy
Greetings McAndy and thank you.
DeleteYes the Scorpio mk2 has very neat moulded recesses for the spare paddle shafts on either side of the compass recess on the fore deck. I already have a sail and full size SLR camera bag on the foredeck so prefer the rear deck for the splits. I had no problems at all with the splits on the rear deck just using the existing deck elastics. If I had been worried a short length of shock cord and an olive round the deck lines would add extra security without needing extra fittings. If I didn't have the camera bag I could use the fore deck for the splits and the sail quite happily.
Douglas :o)
Just read this and I also use the rear deck to carry spare paddle splits as It becomes too cluttered with a camera fitted to a Ram Mount plus a sail. Also nice to have the paddle shafts securing the rear hatch cover in case of rollover.
DeleteI secure the paddle shafts to all my kayaks with a small length of bungee and an olive cleat. Sure, you cannot reach it without help but how often do you paddle alone??
Thanks Anon. A great tip about the bungee and olive. I have a bit permanently attached to my rear deck lines for securing paddles, trolley bag and firewood! :o)
DeleteHi Douglas, having had the earlier version of the scorpio I found the boat way to eager to turn without the skeg. To the point the boat felt like it would be useless in a good breeze or flow without the skeg. Has the design improved any to help reduce this, especially in a following sea?
ReplyDeleteCheers
Steve
Hi Steve the first versions of the Scorpio and the Cetus were as you say eager to turn especially if they were loaded 50 50 front and rear. I drew attention to this behaviour following seas in my long term test of the original Cetus back in 2009. They are much better balanced when loaded 40 60 front and rear. The Scorpio Mk2 and the Cetus LV MV and HV have all improved on this behaviour. But it is a characteristic of boats with wide point at the hips that they need a little skeg off the wind. Boats with the wind point at the paddler's knees like my Nordkapp LV are much less skeg dependent if you like boats like that. However, I certainly can't take my expensive camera out its case in the Nordkapp LV in water conditions that don't bother me at all in a Scorpio Mk2 or a Cetus MV. some coaches don't like boats that are skeg dependent but it really does not bother me at all, all my windsurfers have skegs and I wouldn't dream of using them without. The other thing about skeg neutral boats is they are only neutral if you are the ideal weight. For example my Nordkapp LV handles very neutrally in the wind with my weight but the full size Nordkapp is an absolute beast in a wind unless I have it fully loaded with camping gear. I hope that helps. :)
DeleteHi Douglas, having had the earlier version of the scorpio I found the boat way to eager to turn without the skeg. To the point the boat felt like it would be useless in a good breeze or flow without the skeg. Has the design improved any to help reduce this, especially in a following sea?
ReplyDeleteCheers
Steve
Thanks douglas, some great feedback there and I'm certainly tempted to get one out for a demo.
ReplyDeleteYour explanation as to the ability to stop and take pics on this boat versus the nordkapp lv has certainly made me think of occasions in other boats I have had/used and the fact that being skeg dependant may be a fair trade off :)
Many thanks
Steve
Have you ever test paddled the venture Jura kayak?
ReplyDeleteHi Jake I am sorry for the delay in publishing your post, it got caught in my spam filter for some reason. Yes I have paddled the Venture Jura and for its price it is a very competent kayak. If you bought one as a beginner it would grow with your increasing experience. There is really nothing that you could not do in it. It was an MV I tried and really enjoyed it in challenging conditions on the Solway. My only slight criticism is that the hatch volumes are a bit more restrictive than full size kayaks and beginners might not have compact (and so expensive) camping gear. :o)
ReplyDeleteHi Douglas,
ReplyDeleteHow do you attach your cameras to your Scorpio please? I had tried suction mounts for a GoPro, but without success due to the textured surface and limited smooth areas on the deck.
I was wondering about the sail mounting screw holes, but guess they may not be the right size for AMPS hole pattern on RAM mounts.
Any thoughts?
Many thanks, Ian
Hello Ian, I only managed to get the GoPro suction mount to stick a flat smooth bit of the Scorpios rear deck. I did feed back to P&H that smooth non textured surface on either side of the bow would allow a bow mount. I thought they were going to do that but the bow on the new Scorpio HV I have at the moment is still textured. I did see someone with a bit of perspex plate bolted to the sail mount and the suction mount stuck to that but the bolts need to be clear of the suction area.. Good luck :o)
DeleteFantastic review thank you.
ReplyDeleteHas anyone here tried the Scorpio Mk2 LV version?
I'm a 176cm, 80kg sailor with size 9 UK shoes and 30" inseam...
I guess I'm an early intermediate paddler
I see that the LV is shorter and has less load capacity.. would the lower volume make it handle even better in rough sea condition than the MV when not loaded? Mostly I do day return trips unloaded rather than multi-day camping
Thank you
I am afraid I have not paddled the Scorpio LV. I have paddled The Cetus HV, MV and LV loaded and unloaded when I weighed 80kg, 172cm, size 9 UK and 29" inseam. What I discovered was though I fitted perfectly the LV it was less manoeuvrable than the MV when unloaded. This was because I sank it further than the designed waterline which meant the rear of the keel did not disengage from the waterline on edge as much as it should have. In the MV because I was floating higher the rear of the keel did disengage when on edge on edge. The shorter waterline length greatly enhanced the ability to turn on edge in the MV compared with the LV. I bought a Cetus MV with no regrets and even though I am now 73kg, I still prefer the Cetus MV to the LV.
DeleteWith regard to the Scorpio LV compared with the Cetus LV, the Scorpio has about 20l less volume than the Cetus which equates to 20kg less buoyancy. So I suspect you would find the LV less suitable than the MV but I recommend you try both as there are other factors to consider such as the fit of the cockpit or whether it fits in your garage!
Have fun :)